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Minimum Wage Law

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  1. #11

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    My tuppence worth:

    From my relatively short time in HK, I’ve noticed that there are an awful lot of uneccesary jobs that exist purely because there is a large cheap workforce. Teams of 5-6 people manually weighing & packing veg in supermarkets, for example. I’m not saying minimum wage is a bad thing, but I do think there’s a risk it will encourage companies to streamline their businesses — if labour is no longer cheap, why not, where possible, mechanise things?


  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by chimo:
    Where did you get this $5K MPF info from? The way it works is between 5K-20K you and employer pay 5% each. If under $5K salary, only the employer pays 5% per month.
    Apparently you're right, my mistake.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by chimo:
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I want to know what the benefits are!

    For now, all I see are negatives:
    1) Force low-end workers 'undergound' (work under-the-table and therefore lose benefits like MPF, days off...)
    2) Bosses saying "Ok, fine, ill make you part-time instead and pay you even less"
    The benefits are that it at least puts into motion the prospect of the thousands of appallingly paid workers in Hong Kong having an improved standard of living. To be quite honest, the fact that it is even opposed underlyes the fundamental aspect of the Hong Kong culture, which in my mind is financial greed.

  4. #14

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    No, it will push thousands of workers into part-time or under-the-table jobs. There are tons of Indonesian domestic helpers here who get paid below the minimum wage for domestic helpers! Is it right? No, but this is how life works.

    I understand how we would all like to live in a world where everyone is rich. You want to improve the standard of living? Fix the housing situation!!!


  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by chimo:
    No, it will push thousands of workers into part-time or under-the-table jobs. There are tons of Indonesian domestic helpers here who get paid below the minimum wage for domestic helpers! Is it right? No, but this is how life works.

    I understand how we would all like to live in a world where everyone is rich. You want to improve the standard of living? Fix the housing situation!!!
    As I said before, this is exactly what they said would happen in the UK. It did not happen to any significant degree. It requires enforcement though as per the example of Indonesian helpers you give. If the helper laws were enforced do you think all those paying below the minimum would go without their helpers or instead suddenly find the extra 1000 dollars or so?

    And I don't think we are talking about a world in which everyone is rich, I would guess they are talking about 5-6,000 dollars per month as the minimum wage.
    Last edited by hullexile; 16-10-2008 at 02:55 PM.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by chimo:
    No, it will push thousands of workers into part-time or under-the-table jobs. There are tons of Indonesian domestic helpers here who get paid below the minimum wage for domestic helpers! Is it right? No, but this is how life works.

    I understand how we would all like to live in a world where everyone is rich. You want to improve the standard of living? Fix the housing situation!!!

    As Hullexile has already pointed out, the same concerns were present in the UK prior to the introduction of the minimum wage, they proved to be unfounded. Exploiting people by paying them extremely low wages takes place everyday, as you highlight, this doesn't make it right and is so prevalent because there is insufficient legislation to prevent it.

    I do not believe the 'whole world should be rich' as you put it, however in a supposedly advanced country (ok, SAR) such as Hong Kong, the continued and obvious exploitation of low paid staff by the 'rich' in order to further line their own pockets is not acceptable. Hong Kong lacks an adequate welfare state, which furthers allows for the exploitation of low paid workers as they have no alternative. I am aware that the welfare state issue is a much larger topic than being discussed here, however I do believe that it is relevant to the minimum wage.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullexile:
    As I said before, this is exactly what they said would happen in the UK. It did not happen to any significant degree. It requires enforcement though as per the example of Indonesian helpers you give. If the helper laws were enforced do you think all those paying below the minimum would go without their helpers or instead suddenly find the extra 1000 dollars or so?

    And I don't think we are talking about a world in which everyone is rich, I would guess they are talking about 5-6,000 dollars per month as the minimum wage.
    To the person who is pathetic enough to anonymously red blob me for this with the comment "it is exactly what happened", firstly have the guts to say it on the thread and secondly provide some evidence to support your claim. I am happy to be proved wrong.

  8. #18

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    We just had a residents meeting at our apartment complex last weekend which mentioned the affects of the min wage laws, and the renewal of our existing security staff deployment contract ( expires may 2009 ) of 26 staff for our 292 apartment complex. It costs us $256,000 ( combined ) per month or roughly $876 odd worth of our monthly management fee contribution ( the largest single cost ). The increased staff member salary from the existing $6200 salary per month, will be $8600 per month from next year. As you can imagine, nobody was happy about accepting an increase, so a reduction of staff, via improved electronic alternatives is going to be implemented. Octopus card or our existing car park electronic key pass, to operate all foyer doors and activate lifts, and much more advanced CCTV via a master control room installation. The proposed security improvements will eliminate 9 staff.

    Now, if our apartment block is going to update its security system ( CCTV ) and cut staff, i'd say its probably what everybody else is going to do also...

    Sounds like a great boom business for CCTV firms, as some industries will cut staff, some will hire more, as new industries thrive...

    I don't believe that a min wage situation is going to be all that detrimental, long term its the right thing to do, and HK people always adapt....

    Last edited by Skyhook; 17-10-2008 at 12:54 AM.

  9. #19

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    >> The proposed security improvements will eliminate 9 staff.

    This will happen across all industries affected by any minimum wage situation.

    Right now, the wealth is spread across more people due to the overstaff and underpay situation - given that most of the people affected by this sort of situation are not really going to be trainable to become web designers or stock brokers.

    The salary increase is being proposed at the wrong time - it should be shelved and implemented when we're going through a boom phase and employers are generally less careful with their money than they are now.


  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullexile:
    To the person who is pathetic enough to anonymously red blob me for this with the comment "it is exactly what happened", firstly have the guts to say it on the thread and secondly provide some evidence to support your claim. I am happy to be proved wrong.
    I suspect it was the same person who red-dotted me for my similar post making the same point....