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Has Hong Kong adopted the wrong COVID-19 strategy?

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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peaky:
    Endemic implies a constant level of infection. Many European countries are there already as they've vaxxed children and realistically the ongoing vaccination isn't going to get through to many remaining refuseniks except probably the ethnic groups that will shun it until they go through another bad winter. UK will be there soon.

    Living with Covid absolutely means pandemic over for those countries at least. You don't “live with” a pandemic that threatens your society.

    Obviously though HK's approach means we are going to drag this out, probably avoid 10-15k earlier elderly and vulnerable deaths (probably with 10-12 years extra life expectancy for those folks given just how high longevity is here) but totally destroy tens of thousands of livelihoods and diminish the place forever. It's a value judgement if it's worth it. It's another (in my view far easier) value judgement to compel vaccination and move things along.


    Endemic is a presence of constant level of infection and infectious agents in a particular geographic area. Unfortunately, when the virus is rampant worldwide, how could you come to that conclusion? On what basis?

    It goes on yadda, yadda, yadda but perhaps, you should notify WHO as well to change their view on the prevailing condition-


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    That said, we might stir further away from the main topic so I leave it here.
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  2. #22

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    Japan has a higher vaccination level but their vaccination rate has not plummeted. 60% as a general level is way too low so the vaccination rate to improve that is important.

    Hong Kong has a major problem with unvaccinated elderly, that vaccination rate trend is not going to fix that.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by hannah01:
    You're repeatedly just saying "pull your head out of the sand". Okay, my head is outta the sand now. The thing is -- where is the list of countries that have stirred clear of the Covid?


    @hullexile Surely, it must be longer than we expect. Otherwise, @Sage would've enlisted it here long ago.

    Endemic. Jesus, your brain must've shut down. Reboot it.
    Don't waste time with Sage. He thinks sushi will kill all sea life. He thinks Covid is no big deal and everyone is just hyping it. There is no point debating with him.
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  4. #24

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    It always struck me as strange when the HK government say it can't force mandatory vaccine madates on people when with the NSL has made pretty much any opposition to the government illegal. They eliminated freedom of speech and assembly in HK, yet the government somehow think vaccine mandates contravene the rights of HK people?!

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  5. #25

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    I understand that but Hong Kong has both a stock and flow problem. Clearly Hong Kong is not in the same position as the UK. Getting the numbers up requires the flow to be maintained.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramis:
    There is a price to pay regardless of the strategy adopted. What I do think is that expats seem to vastly overestimate their value and importance to this place. It's clear that HK is transitioning to being assimilated to the mainland therefore policies will change. Expats are mercenaries that will easily be replaced as long as there is money and they make up a tiny minority. It was clear even before COVID that HK will never be the same, it will survive and perhaps even still thrive financially but in a very different way that will likely be less attractive to many expats particularly those that have been here a long time.
    Here's a surprise... HK got it right. It acted early, put in measures and sourced the vaccine. HK set up a vicious test trace and quarantine system which eliminated any outbreaks. The vaccination programme was magnificent but the population were not well informed and it faltered due to traditional beliefs and poor communication.

    What is happening now is not right. We are well past needing the punitive quarantine measures which are political rather than medical needs.

    You do not have to be ethnically Chinese to be a local in Hong Kong, just like any other international city, ethnicity is a superficial measure of belonging. Unfortunately, that seem to be one of the casualties of the "assimilation".

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by kittykaitak:
    Here's a surprise... HK got it right. It acted early, put in measures and sourced the vaccine. HK set up a vicious test trace and quarantine system which eliminated any outbreaks. The vaccination programme was magnificent but the population were not well informed and it faltered due to traditional beliefs and poor communication.

    What is happening now is not right. We are well past needing the punitive quarantine measures which are political rather than medical needs.

    You do not have to be ethnically Chinese to be a local in Hong Kong, just like any other international city, ethnicity is a superficial measure of belonging. Unfortunately, that seem to be one of the casualties of the "assimilation".
    Who is the arbiter of what is "right" and what isn't? Certainly, people don't have to be ethnically Chinese to belong but I would expect people that "belong" to be involved culturally, to speak the language and to respect the ways of the majority of the population. There are certainly some expats that fit that description but my experience is that the vast majority doesn't and a great many come here, fill their pockets and leave after a few years. How many expats have you heard that called themselves immigrants?

    HK had some successes in dealing with this crisis, it also had setbacks and failures. Whatever course countries take has both positive and negative consequences. Depending on people's point of view, these vary greatly. There are a great number of people that feel vaccine mandates infringe on people's personal rights and I believe they have a point however I think that the situation is serious enough that it warrants infringing on those rights to an extent. I'm not arrogant enough to believe that I'm right and they are wrong, it's a choice with no winners, just upsides and downsides. I heard 20 something people say the hell with old folks, they've had a good life now it's my turn. I might have shared that view in my 20s, I don't now but again, I don't have the arrogance of thinking I am "right".

  8. #28

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    they need Xi’s green light to do so..

    Quote Originally Posted by Coolboy:
    It always struck me as strange when the HK government say it can't force mandatory vaccine madates on people when with the NSL has made pretty much any opposition to the government illegal. They eliminated freedom of speech and assembly in HK, yet the government somehow think vaccine mandates contravene the rights of HK people?!
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  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by hannah01:
    Endemic is a presence of constant level of infection and infectious agents in a particular geographic area. Unfortunately, when the virus is rampant worldwide, how could you come to that conclusion? On what basis?

    It goes on yadda, yadda, yadda but perhaps, you should notify WHO as well to change their view on the prevailing condition-


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    You should listen to Peaky, he knows this subject better than you and he's patient enough to explain what you get wrong.

    I don't suffer fools gladly unfortunately.

    Covid cases (and deaths) are continuing to fall globally (as they have for the last 2 months) and large swathes of the world that were hit harder in the past have relatively high levels of immunity. Many countries in the 1st world are now effectively back to normal, have declared covid endemic and are living with it. Many in the 3rd world had a minimal shift from normality to begin with.

    On that basis.

    Pretty straightforward really.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sage:
    On that basis.

    Pretty straightforward really.
    Very straightforward.

    You know where the airport is.

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