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LegCo 2020

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  1. #111

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    The plan is for none of the opposition to sign it (though some I believe have not pledged not to do so) so that Beijing will have no choice other than DQ everyone (bad look for Beijing internationally), or let everyone run (bad for pro-Beijing Camp).


  2. #112

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    Thanks for the clarification...

    Opposition hopefuls vying for a seat in the Hong Kong legislature have been caught between a rock and a hard place, as they remain undecided on whether to pledge to uphold the mini-constitution and swear allegiance to the city.
    the declaration form introduced by the government four years ago, despite lawyers warning they could be disqualified from the race under the new NSL.
    I see.

    the Electoral Affairs Commission (EAC) did not say whether candidates who did not sign would be stopped from running, but reiterated that submission of the form would be considered by returning officers before they determined if the nominations were valid.
    The newcomers, who largely outperformed the incumbent lawmakers in the polls, argued more confrontational tactics were needed in the current political climate.
    Wu announced his stance in a Facebook post on Wednesday night with the sign off, #Don'tlosedignityforaseat.
    This is exactly what I disagree with. Pay lip service, do what you need to do, as quietly as possible, to be in a position to actually influence laws. The lawmakers who got disqualified for the oath-taking already missed out. I don't wish to see this repeated again. It seems immature to fight this little battle, while the pro-Beijing camp has control over Legco and can do things like vote for multi-billion dollar white elephants.

    This is wasting energy and time -- and my own patience as a voting resident. Fight ideology battles elsewhere, but don't miss out on chances to have a say in how this city is run. As a resident, I'm fed up with nothing getting done or done well in this city because so much energy is lost on these big political issues.

    Are there any new NSL-related requirements that the democrats may be likely to also make a fuss about in the future? (It seems no, but that now having the NSL this can be a reason to disqualify candidates for not signing the allegiance form...).
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  3. #113

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiaque:
    Thanks for the clarification...

    This is exactly what I disagree with. Pay lip service, do what you need to do, as quietly as possible, to be in a position to actually influence laws. The lawmakers who got disqualified for the oath-taking already missed out. I don't wish to see this repeated again. It seems immature to fight this little battle, while the pro-Beijing camp has control over Legco and can do things like vote for multi-billion dollar white elephants.

    This is wasting energy and time -- and my own patience as a voting resident. Fight ideology battles elsewhere, but don't miss out on chances to have a say in how this city is run. As a resident, I'm fed up with nothing getting done or done well in this city because so much energy is lost on these big political issues.

    Are there any new NSL-related requirements that the democrats may be likely to also make a fuss about in the future? (It seems no, but that now having the NSL this can be a reason to disqualify candidates for not signing the allegiance form...).
    Even if they do sign the form there is no guarantee that they'll be allowed to run. It's all up to the District Officers, all of whom have been newly-replaced since DC 2019 (see post #101)... I think you see where I'm getting at...

    Beijing won't let them win anyway, I'd be pleasantly surprised if they do play by the rules... The point is to make it all in or all out: The International Community probably won't care if some Edward Leung type (think Ventus Lau, etc...) get DQed, they are a bit too extreme for the intl palate. They will however care about it if no one from the dems will be allowed to run.
    @Elegiaque, I appreciate your optimism but confirmation paper or not, the pro-Beijing camp will never lose control over LegCo nor will the pro-democracy camp be able to block Lantau 'Tomorrow' or more bridges to nowhere.
    Last edited by MatthieuTofu; 22-07-2020 at 03:18 PM.

  4. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by MatthieuTofu:
    Even if they do sign the form there is no guarantee that they'll be allowed to run. It's all up to the District Officers, all of whom have been newly-replaced since DC 2019 (see post #101)... I think you see where I'm getting at...
    If they do sign the form pre-screening becomes normalised and will surely continue to evolve to shape who can become a legislator. But I do agree it would be better to win the mandate and be disqualified than lose on a point of principle. Legco really doesn't have any powers left and can't stop wasting money on white elephants or badly written bills from passing.

  5. #115

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    No, I will have some optimism. The NSL was an act of desperation. Banning books and songs has never gone down well in history. But I can't see how this will play out. There tends to be a backhanded ways of doing things... taking back the ELAB, only a year later to give us NSL. Perhaps the dems will get 35 something seats in Legco, only to have a new "agency" set up devoted to approving financial packages for construction projects. Who knows...

    Last edited by Elegiaque; 22-07-2020 at 03:50 PM.

  6. #116

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiaque:
    No, I will have some optimism. The NSL was an act of desperation. Banning books and songs has never gone down well in history. But I can't see how this will play out. There tends to be a backhanded ways of doing things... taking back the ELAB, only a year later to give us NSL. Perhaps the dems will get 35 something seats in Legco, only to have a new "agency" set up devoted to approving financial packages for construction projects. Who knows...
    I would guess the executive would table a raft of unpalatable laws wrapped up with useful laws. Pan-dems will reject them all and be thrown out for subverting the state and ban them all from running in the next rapidly called election.
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  7. #117

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    As I said, I am not sure of the best course of action. As some of you more sympathetic to the pro-dem side have said, better to have a horse in the race, which I certainly agree with, even if the race is rigged, but you also have to be conscious of the fact that you are giving up on the principle that there should not be pre-screening, and that in any event, the DOs can DQ you anyway. There is a real cost to legitimising the practice, particularly when you can insert virtually anything into the Basic Law by insertion and not just relevant matters (arguable that the Basic Law is already not being respected by the establishment, which should in theory be a shield, not a sword [hence all the new references with the Basic Law being subject to Mainland constitution etc.]) How do you run on resisting unfairness by giving in to unfairness (NSL in the Basic Law via NPC “interpretation”)?

    Having said that, I am agnostic as to the approach taken, so long as it’s adopted consistently by the larger camp. What worries me is if a different approach is taken between candidates. The latest I understand is that the functional constituency legislators may sign the form. This may be a reasonable approach for professional sector representatives, but it does weaken the collective effect of bogus mass disqualifications. Since there is a geographical/functional constituency split though, it could be carried out logically.

    The last thing to note is that before the NSL, the mainstream parties were actually the ones who refused to sign, and were not disqualified. Since the intent was mainly to pick off candidates they disliked, it was meant to be a pretext. Disqualifying candidates who did sign just showed up their intent the last time. A few of the mainstream party candidates also came out this time and already declared they would not sign this time either. Best not to fixate on which camps or persons will or will not sign and just hope for the best that you can do your part when the time comes.


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  9. #119

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    The Fok family have held the sport and culture seat at LegCo for 22 years.

    Herbert Chow owns a kids clothing store and likes Tennis.

    Who would be best to drive the development and prioritise sport and culture in Hong Kong?


    https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/...er-contacts-he

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  10. #120

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    Wait is that seriously his only link to the sporting world?

    Fok, who married retired diver and Olympic gold-medal winner Guo Jingjing in 2012, will represent the pro-establishment camp in September’s contest for the seat of the functional constituency of sports, performing arts, culture and publication.
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