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National Security Law - Passed - 30th June 2020

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  1. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by prospectiveHKer:
    This may be overoptimistic, but there's a chance they hold off on actually doing this to prove how the law rarely needs to be used, is mostly a deterrent, etc. A way of responding to the foreign criticism as well without losing face (or powers) by having withdrawn it.
    Methinks they won't do anything for a while, maybe a week or two or a month, until the rest of the world stops looking, and then there will be knocks at night, and several (i.e. tens) activists, journalists, politicians will be rounded up never to be seen again. The rest of the world won't really care, because they want to keep selling to China. Then it will be any (i.e. thousands) young person who ever participated in a protest, to be send to reeducation camps in the mainland.
    Coolboy, AsianXpat0, JC83 and 4 others like this.

  2. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by john_1122:
    Methinks they won't do anything for a while, maybe a week or two or a month, until the rest of the world stops looking, and then there will be knocks at night, and several (i.e. tens) activists, journalists, politicians will be rounded up never to be seen again. The rest of the world won't really care, because they want to keep selling to China. Then it will be any (i.e. thousands) young person who ever participated in a protest, to be send to reeducation camps in the mainland.
    The lack of retroactivity in the law seems to suggest they may wait for people to be lulled into a false sense of security and do something that challenges its terms, or to provoke a reaction, however long that takes. In the meantime, they can just enjoy everyone's self-censorship. Journalists may also be "safe" thanks to the "guidance" they receive effectively preventing them from doing anything that might violate the law anyway.

  3. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by prospectiveHKer:
    This seems intended to create an atmosphere of fear more than anything. The text of the law requires a connection between "inciting hatred" and "foreign groups," at least. Not to say such connections couldn't be made up, but he seems to be misconstruing the contents of the text.

    Of course maybe he's referring to a situation in which the mainland exercises jurisdiction, but it's hard to imagine they're going to exercise that every time someone criticizes the police. After all, they put a whole local apparatus into operation, presumably for the minor stuff.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/XinqiSu/s...62358397886464

    Or they could just want the window dressing.

  4. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by stickyears:
    Not verified, I guess we'll see later...

    https://mobile.twitter.com/bakeentot...49760101183488
    Shout in English - the police wont understand?

  5. #95

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    Quote Originally Posted by AsianXpat0:
    https://mobile.twitter.com/XinqiSu/s...62358397886464

    Or they could just want the window dressing.
    The tiniest differences between the systems may be all that HK has left to hold on to, so it's important to try and figure out what they are. The "window dressing" still might mean the difference, on many occasions, between a jury trial in HK and a secret trial on the mainland.

  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by prospectiveHKer:
    The lack of retroactivity in the law seems to suggest they may wait for people to be lulled into a false sense of security and do something that challenges its terms, or to provoke a reaction, however long that takes. In the meantime, they can just enjoy everyone's self-censorship. Journalists may also be "safe" thanks to the "guidance" they receive effectively preventing them from doing anything that might violate the law anyway.
    It seems to me that the law is so broad, they can arrest anybody on any flimsy excuse and put them in prison for life. E.g. you are queuing at the MTR station: you are disrupting public transportation which equals terrorism and life imprisonment. You post a message on a foreign website, you are colluding with foreigners which equals terrorism and life imprisonment.

    Thousands of people have been arrested, and they can just make up whatever excuse to give them life. Plus, trials will be closed door and all judges will be sent here by the mainland. They don't even have to come up with a reason.
    AsianXpat0 likes this.

  7. #97

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    Quote Originally Posted by prospectiveHKer:
    The tiniest differences between the systems may be all that HK has left to hold on to, so it's important to try and figure out what they are. The "window dressing" still might mean the difference, on many occasions, between a jury trial in HK and a secret trial on the mainland.
    I think you may be failing to appreciate that the words don’t matter. They mean whatever they want it to mean. You are expected to terrorise yourself into silent submission, or otherwise bravely go about your business under a potential cloud in future. They would never draw a clear line that constrains themselves both because they want the freedom for arbitrariness, as well as create the fear factor.

    The window dressing I’m talking about is trying to keep up the fiction. You’re an optimist in thinking that it extends to actual practice.
    Coolboy, john_1122 and Baklava like this.

  8. #98

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    Original Post Deleted
    Quite so. This is a perfect situation for the CCP, they got their hated NSL through into law and made it nasty enough that they can arrest anyone, keep them locked up indefinitely, take over trials, impose their own judges whenever they like. Bonus points for keeping it so vague that basically any activity can be used to persecute anyone they do not like.

    It is a massive coup for them.
    john_1122, AsianXpat0, rs4 and 1 others like this.

  9. #99

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  10. #100

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