4 June censorship in China

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  1. #81

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    Who says that democracy is the be all and end all ?

    Unless your ambition is to control the working poor, to supply the wealthy, who provide the capital so the proletariat have a job, then American style democracy follows the Orwellian mold, pretty much to the letter.

    The Marxist view below pretty much explains the current US democratic system below:

    The Marxist view is fundamentally opposed to liberal democracy believing that the capitalist state cannot be democratic by its nature, as it represents the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie. Marxism views liberal democracy as an unrealistic utopia. This is because they believe that in a capitalist state all "independent" media and most political parties are controlled by capitalists and one either needs large financial resources or to be supported by the bourgeoisie to win an election.

    Sounds familiar aye, any candidate with millions of dollars backing them, has a good chance of getting into the senate, if not the Whitehouse. Joe average out in the ghetto has no chance, only if he follows the way of the bourgeoisie, will he ever get a look in.

    In my opinion ( American ) democracy on its own is not the way of the future, as it does not represent all classes equally.

    A democratic version of Marxism, I believe would be a better system of social equality, and in a manner of speaking closer to the Star Trek ideal, than the current lets just get rich quick at the expense of the poor idea.. The proletariat continue to be controlled by the American bourgeoisie capitalists, today, and will continue, until the prols eventually revolt.

    Anyway, it is probably best that we don't discuss politics, as it generally always upsets peoples interests, which will always come first, over other people, who come second if it threatens their lively hood, although some like to use nice sounding spin to mask democracy's rotten core, that lurks beneath the Zegna suit, but that's o.k...

    Last edited by Skyhook; 06-06-2009 at 12:23 AM.

  2. #82

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    I agree that there are many problems with the US's political system. But when I use the word "democracy", it's just an idea, "rule by the people", and I also believe it should at least be accompanied by freedom of the press in order to be truly democratic. But in terms of implementation, there are a million ways. No two democracies are alike. Indeed, who says a "democratic version of Marxism" can't be democracy? The socialist states in Northern Europe are very different from the US, or the UK, or India. Yet they all share attributes of political systems that can be called democratic. China, if it does evolve towards a more democratic system, will likely create its own version, that will need to continue to evolve as this massive country undergo fundamental changes in so many fronts.


  3. #83

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    Good Post JT06. I completely agree, and believe that the middle kingdom, will likely develop/evolve into its own version of democracy, possibly with Marxist inferences, while being culturally in sync with the Chinese people, having enough western awareness to keep things stable ie friendly on an international point of view.

    I don't believe that China will become another Japan, possibly a Sth Korea, hard to say really, but I will say we certainly live in interesting times.

    In my opinion 1989 was a wake up call for China, and those CCP members who evolved from that experience, have changed China for the better. Lets not be ignorant of that fact, regardless of who said what in the past ( satisfying the party line ), actions speak much louder than words, China having made very definite progress, in mostly good ways. For a country that has such a massive population, its done a pretty good job, all things considered.

    Last edited by Skyhook; 06-06-2009 at 10:16 AM.

  4. #84

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    No miracle will ever clean the memory, brutal and obscene,
    Of those who, having fouled their trust,
    Grew warped with dread and powerlust -
    And order fire on the Square,
    On unarmed people everywhere,
    Brave people seeking to be free,
    Of rottenness, of tyranny.

    Vikram Seth, 1989


  5. #85

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    On the 20th anniversary of June 4 in Hong Kong...



    Crammed close, lit up, the crowds
    with hardly a mask
    in sight

    "Lest we forget"

    ?

    [Photo: BeerBoxerBoy's.]

    Last edited by emmie; 08-06-2009 at 12:21 AM.

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