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Leung Chun-ying - a cunning leader

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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mat:
    The scary bit is that the one who has no chance was actually the best...
    Kind of like the US where Ron Paul makes the most sense on many fiscal and economic and military issues for this same reason.

    In France the right wing candidate for President spent more time trying to find 500 elected officials (mayors, etc) than actually campaigning on her misguided policies.

    In Canada now you can win your party's nomination for Parliament as I did in 1972 as the locals voted me in but now you have to have the Leader's signature too making Canada increasingly less democratic.

    I was flirting with another run for Parliament in 2000 but was told by those in the know that I had to get the blessing of a non-elected back room person - the same guy as named a short time after for some involvement in a gov't sale of BC Rail (he was never charged) scandal where gov't officials were giving secrets to one of the potential buyers! These same guys couped the sitting PM Jean Chretien and destroyed the party when their guy Paul Martin took over.

    Politics the world over is not the nicest game in town. It is ugly.

    HK is bizarre as to the process of constituencies.

    I can see that none of these HK candidate's can get that changed if elected and the rule of thumb in politics is not to get into things they can't change. There is no upside in getting hooked to answer that stuff.

    In Canada no one wins by arguing for something that requires Constitutional change as it can't happen so no one in any party is dumb enough to call for it unless it is the party that can't win anyway like the Greens there. In the US the same thing but at least they can and do make Amendments.
    dear giant and Watercooler like this.

  2. #32

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    This is quite depressing!
    Is there actually ANYONE in Hong Kong that could make a good CE? The calibre of all the legco members and Government heads are so p*ss poor.
    There is NOT a single person I can point to and say he/she is CE calibre....

    Long Hair - will be disqualified before he starts.
    Wong Yuk Man - Too loud and basically can't image him being in any summit dinners
    Rita Fan - Perish the thought... will u turn at everything
    Alan Leong - Too smarmy a lawyer and would not do anything for anyone except lawyers
    Anyone from the pro democracy camp - No experience, only good in opposition
    Anyone from the pro Government camp - No experience with no one of any status

    The only person I can really think of that can really do a good job is .... Emily Lau! Even though I disagree on her position most of the time, she is strong, decisive and intelligent and really stands out a mile from the others.

    bookblogger and Dreadnought like this.

  3. #33

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    There is no political leader because until very reently there were no need to have some.

    HK was under british colonial rule for 150 years and locally only good bureaucrates were groomed.

    It takes years if not one full generation to develop strong political senses within the community and to see leaders emerged.

    You do not create a demorcacy overnight. It takes time.


  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by HKITperson:
    This is quite depressing!
    Is there actually ANYONE in Hong Kong that could make a good CE? The calibre of all the legco members and Government heads are so p*ss poor.
    There is NOT a single person I can point to and say he/she is CE calibre....

    Long Hair - will be disqualified before he starts.
    Wong Yuk Man - Too loud and basically can't image him being in any summit dinners
    Rita Fan - Perish the thought... will u turn at everything
    Alan Leong - Too smarmy a lawyer and would not do anything for anyone except lawyers
    Anyone from the pro democracy camp - No experience, only good in opposition
    Anyone from the pro Government camp - No experience with no one of any status

    The only person I can really think of that can really do a good job is .... Emily Lau! Even though I disagree on her position most of the time, she is strong, decisive and intelligent and really stands out a mile from the others.
    My first choice would be Lee Cheuk-yan. He's principled and articulate. I hope to see a system one day in which people like him have a fair chance at office.
    dear giant, Dreadnought and Gatts like this.

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by HKITperson:
    This is quite depressing!
    Is there actually ANYONE in Hong Kong that could make a good CE? The calibre of all the legco members and Government heads are so p*ss poor.
    There is NOT a single person I can point to and say he/she is CE calibre....

    Long Hair - will be disqualified before he starts.
    Wong Yuk Man - Too loud and basically can't image him being in any summit dinners
    Rita Fan - Perish the thought... will u turn at everything
    Alan Leong - Too smarmy a lawyer and would not do anything for anyone except lawyers
    Anyone from the pro democracy camp - No experience, only good in opposition
    Anyone from the pro Government camp - No experience with no one of any status

    The only person I can really think of that can really do a good job is .... Emily Lau! Even though I disagree on her position most of the time, she is strong, decisive and intelligent and really stands out a mile from the others.
    Isn't Emily Lau from the pro democracy camp?

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Football16:
    Kind of like the US where Ron Paul makes the most sense on many fiscal and economic and military issues for this same reason.

    In France the right wing candidate for President spent more time trying to find 500 elected officials (mayors, etc) than actually campaigning on her misguided policies.

    In Canada now you can win your party's nomination for Parliament as I did in 1972 as the locals voted me in but now you have to have the Leader's signature too making Canada increasingly less democratic.

    I was flirting with another run for Parliament in 2000 but was told by those in the know that I had to get the blessing of a non-elected back room person - the same guy as named a short time after for some involvement in a gov't sale of BC Rail (he was never charged) scandal where gov't officials were giving secrets to one of the potential buyers! These same guys couped the sitting PM Jean Chretien and destroyed the party when their guy Paul Martin took over.

    Politics the world over is not the nicest game in town. It is ugly.

    HK is bizarre as to the process of constituencies.

    I can see that none of these HK candidate's can get that changed if elected and the rule of thumb in politics is not to get into things they can't change. There is no upside in getting hooked to answer that stuff.

    In Canada no one wins by arguing for something that requires Constitutional change as it can't happen so no one in any party is dumb enough to call for it unless it is the party that can't win anyway like the Greens there. In the US the same thing but at least they can and do make Amendments.
    Interesting, which constituency did you represent? House of Commons I presume? Liberal, NDP or the Tories? The PM and his cabinet are the ones that hold real policy-making powers anyway. If one look at it another way, the party discipline that underlies parliamentary democracies isn't always that good for true democratic accountability. As an individual MP, you have little say, since one vote as a unified block in the legislature. And one could argue that the "brokerage system" that used to exist in the Canada party system wasn't too conducive to true democracy. So in some aspects, one can argue that democracy has improved slightly...a very debatable point of course.
    Last edited by Watercooler; 23-03-2012 at 08:59 PM.

  7. #37

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    Well folks, it is looking increasingly likely that Leung will get the CE job. Remarkable in a way if you look at it as a "come-from-behind victory" for Leung. Although in some ways Tang did himself in through his own incompetent management of his campaign. His rich boy background and perception as a tycoon's puppet did'nt exactly help.

    Leung as a CE will pose a bigger challenge to the pro-democrats than Tung or Donald. Tung was a lousy businessman who simply took orders from Beijing and had no political sense. Donald was better off being a civil servant administering policies than the one initiating policies. Leung on the other hand is a different animal. He can manage and manipulate his message far better. The pro-democrats better be afraid. Very afraid.


  8. #38

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    Stop Press

    From RTHK:

    DAB to back CY Leung in CE poll

    23-03-2012
    ... The DAB says it has decided to support C.Y. Leung in the chief executive election. It announced the decision after a meeting of the party's central committee. The DAB will suggest to its 147 members on the Election Committee that they vote for Mr Leung in Sunday's election.

    The party's vice chairwoman, Starry Lee, said they considered Mr Leung to be a more suitable candidate for Hong Kong's top job than Henry Tang. She added that Mr Leung enjoyed support from much of the public and had a relatively high popularity rating.


  9. #39

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    "It announced the decision after a meeting of the party's central committee."

    ... or after a phone call from Beijing's liaison office, of course.


  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by bookblogger:
    after a phone call from Beijing's liaison office, of course.
    What has been promised to the masters up-north in return for being 'chosen'?
    Last edited by East_coast; 23-03-2012 at 10:02 PM.
    dear giant likes this.

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