Why FDH no need to go through a probation period !

[INXS]

i wish. see these kinds of complaints all the time. i have a neighbour who has been going around whinging about her helper asking to go to bed at 11pm (their helper wakes at 5am to work). she seriously feels like her helper is taking advantage of them. Such a twisted sense of entitlement...

similarly see employers asking for helpers to do all sorts of things that violate labour laws.

saw online just yesterday some guy in Disco Bay asking "Can anyone refer me a helper? 80' sq ft, Discovery Bay, working couple with 3 year old kid, live in Kitchen, with air conditioning. Most helpers are not happy with the live in kitchen but there is no extra room to let the helper sleep. If you know any good helper that doesn't cares too much about this, please let me know asap. "

its like he doesn't seem to think there is anything wrong with housing a person in his kitchen - hey at least it has ac!

I wouldn't house a helper in the kitchen but, you must realise she probably slept on the floor with 10 other people in a room at home.

[elliee]

I wouldn't house a helper in the kitchen but, you must realise she probably slept on the floor with 10 other people in a room at home.

maybe, maybe not. Plenty of helpers live in decent sized homes in the Philippines and Indonesia, they live with family and can do as they please and the situation is in no way comparable to living under an employers roof abroad. Anyway, their conditions at home should have noting to do with employers complying with the law here. Why do people always point out how terrible their helper has it at home when justifying crap treatment in HK?!! Its still illegal in HK as it doesn't meet the Immigration's requirements for privacy and the point is he seemed to think nothing of asking for a helper who would accept an illegal arrangement. the level of disregard for labour laws here (by some people) is just pathetic.

[flameproof]

there is no extra room to let the helper sleep.

People that can't provide accommodation for a FDH should not be allowed to hire one. Period.

[z754103]

[
similarly see employers asking for helpers to do all sorts of things that violate labour laws.

saw online just yesterday some guy in Disco Bay asking "Can anyone refer me a helper? 800' sq ft, Discovery Bay, working couple with 3 year old kid, live in Kitchen, with air conditioning. Most helpers are not happy with the live in kitchen but there is no extra room to let the helper sleep. If you know any good helper that doesn't cares too much about this, please let me know asap. "

its like he doesn't seem to think there is anything wrong with housing a person in his kitchen - hey at least it has ac![/QUOTE]

Amazing people will put up an ad stating requirements that are illegal. You'd have thought it's easy for ID + Labour Dept to check up on violations :-)

As an employee, I was also glad to see the Labour Dept upholding the legal principle that employees can't sign away their legal rights. It could be me one day needing that protection - my employer typically makes people sign all sorts of things to get their severance package, with the implicit threat of 'it's this or nothing'.

Coming back to the OP's original question. Very typical of ALL job interviews and employee selection, and not just a DH issue. Often the worst ones at the job can interview best. And it's always hard to find good employees, as you need someone good at the job AND who'll fit well with the people they have to work with. Hurdle's much higher if you're sharing living space!

Which is why when I hire people in my team, I try to 'test drive' them by making them do similar things to their duties as part of the interview process, and ask open ended 'test' questions (lots of examples given in this forum for DH). No one is going to spend an interview telling you what they're not good at!

Surely if someone is *that* clueless about basic childcare safety issues, that's quite easy to screen out in an interview? It's more the 'second order' stuff that's a bit hard to figure out without a test drive, no?

[elliee]

The contract content of the FDH contracts must be changed urgently:
Helpers need to have a probation period as every normal HKG employee also have - 3 months.

Helpers are totally protected by the HKG labour law - who is protecting the employer ?
I will contact relevant Government departments to discuss a change on that policy.

A few more things for you to consider.

What would a probation period do?? Employment is already at will and a helper can be let go at any time with statutory notice or payment in lieu. Do you mean that you want to be able to terminate within 3 months without payment or notice? That would be illegal for any employer in HK under the employment ordinance. Are you proposing discrimination against helpers be built into the labour laws by adding more onerous provisions that are only applicable to helpers?

Also, get your facts straight, please. "[E]very normal HKG employee" does NOT have a 3 month probation period, some do, some don't. And all employees on a probation period are still afforded protections under the labour laws, including payment of one month salary or one month notice of termination.

[shenwen]

I asked our helper not to call me sir...she said, "Okay sir.".

Been trying for five years. Told her to call me Michael. Now calls me "sir michael"

[INXS]

maybe, maybe not. Plenty of helpers live in decent sized homes in the Philippines and Indonesia, they live with family and can do as they please and the situation is in no way comparable to living under an employers roof abroad. Anyway, their conditions at home should have noting to do with employers complying with the law here. Why do people always point out how terrible their helper has it at home when justifying crap treatment in HK?!! Its still illegal in HK as it doesn't meet the Immigration's requirements for privacy and the point is he seemed to think nothing of asking for a helper who would accept an illegal arrangement. the level of disregard for labour laws here (by some people) is just pathetic.

Fair enough...some helpers lived in decent sized homes, some didn't. What about their choice? Disregard the law for a second as it's obviously illegal anyway, what if the helper really doesn't give a shit? Plus, the employer is being up front about it.

[TheBrit]

Fair enough...some helpers lived in decent sized homes, some didn't. What about their choice? Disregard the law for a second as it's obviously illegal anyway, what if the helper really doesn't give a shit? Plus, the employer is being up front about it.

So it is fine to disregard laws that we don't like? As long as we are up front about it?

Where do you park your bike? I fancy a bike

[MovingIn07]

I asked our helper not to call me sir...she said, "Okay sir.".

Filipine people call EVERYONE Ma'm or Sir. Doesn't seem to matter who. I can't get my clients to stop doing it so I just ignore it.

[INXS]

So it is fine to disregard laws that we don't like? As long as we are up front about it?

Where do you park your bike? I fancy a bike

Lol...fair enough...actually, I did say that you would have to disregard the law to even consider it. I'm asking the question, notwithstanding the law, as it were...