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Electric Scooter Trials on Bicycle Paths

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  1. #51

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    Feb 2005
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    Beware, recent crackdown by the PoPo on electric scooters, unicycle etc on the roads, saw many local FB videos of the PoPo chasing riders on electric scooters and some pictures of locals getting ticketed. Expect Large fines $$$$


  2. #52

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    429
    Quote Originally Posted by hike:

    I want to ride my bike. I do what I need to do so, perhaps why non-locals tend to get into cases more deeply is the need for “social justice” over just getting through the case at hand. In fact, in my case police encouraged me to settle too. The reason they suggested I pay was cuz it seemed to them at the time that I was at fault, or at least their may have been a good case against me.
    I don't think it's a need for social justice that gets foreigners more deeply into cases; It's a number of factors and racism by the police is part of that, as well as the more corrupt approach to the law in Chinese society. But also the higher risks to an expat going through the court system, it's increased opacity to foreigners (The unwritten rules rather than the written ones) and the greater risks that conviction represents to expats.

    And getting back to my central point, that there is no penalty sanction imposed on people who make false stamens - Surely the police should be held to higher standards? But even they get off scott free when caught lying on statements and in court. The system actively incentives people to lie by not punishing it.

    https://hongkongfp.com/2020/08/13/ho..._3M6OohdjDF5yQ

  3. #53

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    20,496
    Quote Originally Posted by Sage:
    I don't think it's a need for social justice that gets foreigners more deeply into cases; It's a number of factors and racism by the police is part of that, as well as the more corrupt approach to the law in Chinese society. But also the higher risks to an expat going through the court system, it's increased opacity to foreigners (The unwritten rules rather than the written ones) and the greater risks that conviction represents to expats.

    And getting back to my central point, that there is no penalty sanction imposed on people who make false stamens - Surely the police should be held to higher standards? But even they get off scott free when caught lying on statements and in court. The system actively incentives people to lie by not punishing it.

    https://hongkongfp.com/2020/08/13/ho..._3M6OohdjDF5yQ
    Bet Hui, Lam get and Lo promoted after this.

  4. #54

    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    218

    There is accountability, but it only starts when you demand police investigate the other party. Trust me, it happens, but YOU need to do it.

    1. Case 1: You are suspect of careless cycling when in fact you did nothing wrong. You are cautioned. The other party is technically a “witness”.
    2. Case 2: The other person is a suspect of perverting the course of justice. You give a statement as a witness in which you state your accusation. The other person is cautioned and asked to give a statement.

    The problem is proving motive/intention and then there are the genuine mistakes (grey areas) a witness may make of perception vs reality as opposed to outright.

    People treat police like a spoiled child who expects that their maid will fix their problems when they are upset. When a person abuses police resources and then gets to sit in the chair as an arrested person / cautioned witness, they will appreciate the significance of their actions. It doesn’t matter if ultimately charges are dropped, the experience of police investigating them is enough. The investigating officers have noted this to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sage:
    I don't think it's a need for social justice that gets foreigners more deeply into cases; It's a number of factors and racism by the police is part of that, as well as the more corrupt approach to the law in Chinese society. But also the higher risks to an expat going through the court system, it's increased opacity to foreigners (The unwritten rules rather than the written ones) and the greater risks that conviction represents to expats.

    And getting back to my central point, that there is no penalty sanction imposed on people who make false stamens - Surely the police should be held to higher standards? But even they get off scott free when caught lying on statements and in court. The system actively incentives people to lie by not punishing it.

    https://hongkongfp.com/2020/08/13/ho..._3M6OohdjDF5yQ

  5. #55

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    429
    Quote Originally Posted by hike:
    There is accountability, but it only starts when you demand police investigate the other party. Trust me, it happens, but YOU need to do it.

    1. Case 1: You are suspect of careless cycling when in fact you did nothing wrong. You are cautioned. The other party is technically a “witness”.
    2. Case 2: The other person is a suspect of perverting the course of justice. You give a statement as a witness in which you state your accusation. The other person is cautioned and asked to give a statement.

    The problem is proving motive/intention and then there are the genuine mistakes (grey areas) a witness may make of perception vs reality as opposed to outright.

    People treat police like a spoiled child who expects that their maid will fix their problems when they are upset. When a person abuses police resources and then gets to sit in the chair as an arrested person / cautioned witness, they will appreciate the significance of their actions. It doesn’t matter if ultimately charges are dropped, the experience of police investigating them is enough. The investigating officers have noted this to me.
    So who is going to be making the accusation and having the police investigated for them lying in court? The district councillor? And the police are gonna act? Ni.a.i.v.e. . . . If you've been through the court system because you were wrongly accused and hemmoraged money on legal fees, that last thing you want to to do is take on another case, even if you can do so for free.

    The fact is, it just doesn't happen with any significance,, no matter what your police offer told you - The innocent are NOT protected against false accusation in HK.

  6. #56

    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    218

    I didn’t say the accused are protected, just that he/she can throw the ball the other way. Your legal defence is not related to your counter accusation directly and neither should you view it as such. Look at it as education or an awakening for the other party or a form of social justice. It won’t cost you anything to file a case as a witness. You aren’t the one suing the criminal who gave a false testimony.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sage:
    So who is going to be making the accusation and having the police investigated for them lying in court? The district councillor? And the police are gonna act? Ni.a.i.v.e. . . . If you've been through the court system because you were wrongly accused and hemmoraged money on legal fees, that last thing you want to to do is take on another case, even if you can do so for free.

    The fact is, it just doesn't happen with any significance,, no matter what your police offer told you - The innocent are NOT protected against false accusation in HK.

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