ABC Applying for ROA - and PRC Issues

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  1. #11

    Join Date
    Apr 2006
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    16

    application in person in HK. Went back to my home country and all extra info needed by immigration were sent by post/fax/mail.


  2. #12

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Sha TIn
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    276
    Quote Originally Posted by cybernator
    this is interesting.
    i am in the same situation as Aritaurus, but my application was declined based on Article 5.
    As my parents were settled abroad at the time of my birth, I am NOT considered as a Chinese Citizen and therefore not eligible for any card (ROA/RTL)

    So Aritaurus can you provide some extra information?
    Did your application got through the first time already?
    I can go the the Registration of Persons (ROP) office for a formal determination, but I need to know how to make a good argument for my eligibility.
    Did you apply under category c? Or should I make it clear that my parents did not declare a change of nationality at the time of my birth?

    My application went through the first time without any problems. My brother's application was also approved.

    From what I remember, I applied under non-chinese citizen to parents who have the Right of Abode in Hong Kong or something along those lines. They asked for a lot of documents like my parent's old British dependent territory passports, Canadian landing papers, Canadian naturalization certificates , all previous Canadian passports with Hong Kong stamps and endorsements. I just had to make a few declarations saying that Hong Kong is now my place of residence and I have made all necessary arrangements for me to stay there etc. I was approved in less than a month.

    The immigration department has on record that my parents are Chinese citizens because when they applied to renew their cards, they selected the category of Chinese citizen born in Hong Kong. I also had both of my parent's Hong Kong Permanent Identity cards on hand when I applied.

    I think it's really the immigration officer's call since only one person reviews your case and stays in correspondance with you. The person I had was nice and when I submitted all the documents for verification, they gave me an approval letter right away and I was able to get my temporary ID the very same day.

    If this doesn't work out, try applying again. There shouldn't be any reason for them to decline your RTL if you have all the documents they ask for and if your parents never formally renounced their Chinese citizenship.

    Good luck !
    Last edited by Aritaurus; 12-06-2007 at 02:39 AM.

  3. #13

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Sha TIn
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    Quote Originally Posted by youngjediboy
    Same situation as you guys... xBC and got the RTL.

    At the immigration office, the officer said that the RTL is actually better because there's no time limits/contraints! For a ROA, you'd have to naturalize after 7 years and then after have to worry about not being away for 3 years. With RTL, we can still travel and work in HK freely WHENEVER!

    Like stated, the main difference between RTL and ROA/3 stars is not getting to vote and getting deported for serious crimes... but if you don't vote and don't do anything stupid, you're fine!

    Also as foreign citizens none of us can get the Home Return Permit for PRC anyway, so it doesn't matter.

    Cyber, that's weird because none of us are considered Chinese Citizens but we should be able to at least get the RTL and ID card. Were both your parents HK born and immigrated to another country, then came back and both now have the updated HKSAR passports and ID cards?

    The two statuses are the very much the same but I still wouldn't say that RTL is better than ROA. With ROA, if you leave Hong Kong for more than 36 months, you'll automatically be downgraded back to RTL. You won't lose your permanent residency. Also, when it comes to seeking employment, the employer will not ask for your passport. The Permanent HKID alone is sufficient enough to prove that you are eligible to work in Hong Kong. If you have RTL , you would also have to present your passport with the label showing that you have no limitations to your stay in Hong Kong. You'll also have to get a new label from immigration every couple of years as your passport expires.

    After seven years, it's your choice of whether or not you want to be naturalised a Chinese citizen. Of course if you do so, you'll be entitled to the Right of Abode regardless of how long you reside outside Hong Kong.
    Last edited by Aritaurus; 12-06-2007 at 03:39 AM.

  4. #14

    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    174
    Quote Originally Posted by Aritaurus
    The two statuses are the very much the same but I still wouldn't say that RTL is better than ROA. With ROA, if you leave Hong Kong for more than 36 months, you'll automatically be downgraded back to RTL.
    Yes and no, if you have ROA you can still be away from HK for as long as you wish. To retain your ROA, all you need to do is enter HK at least once every 3 years even if it is only for a day.

  5. #15

    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    4

    Process Question

    Quote Originally Posted by cybernator
    application in person in HK. Went back to my home country and all extra info needed by immigration were sent by post/fax/mail.
    Hello Cybernator,

    I am new to this process and I am in a similar situation. I am an ABC whose father was born in HK and mother is from Taiwan. When I was born my parents had a greencard for the states. I was born before 1997, and also born before 1983.

    May I ask, which form did you start out with? Is it form 881, using section 7 as your justification? I'm hoping that since my father has and continues to have ROA (he holds the HK ID card currently) I can "inherit" the RTL.

    Thanks

  6. #16

    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    4

    Quick Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Aritaurus
    My application went through the first time without any problems. My brother's application was also approved.

    From what I remember, I applied under non-chinese citizen to parents who have the Right of Abode in Hong Kong or something along those lines. They asked for a lot of documents like my parent's old British dependent territory passports, Canadian landing papers, Canadian naturalization certificates , all previous Canadian passports with Hong Kong stamps and endorsements. I just had to make a few declarations saying that Hong Kong is now my place of residence and I have made all necessary arrangements for me to stay there etc. I was approved in less than a month.


    Good luck !
    Hi Aritaurus: May I ask what are "your parents landing papers"?

    I ask because my parents, who are now US citizens, have their student visa when they came to the US in the 60s. However, they don't have anything marked as "Landing Paper" in the US. Is this a Landing Paper?

    Furthermore, I intent to be back in HK for a week later this summer. Does it make sense for me to send form 881 (Do I start with this form) in the mail first in advance of my trip, or should I just hit them with 881 while I'm there. I'll only be in HK a week this time.

    Thanks

  7. #17

    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    16

    i used the `Application for Verification of Eligibility for
    Permanent Identity Card` form -> ROP145 form
    And applied under category 3:Persons of Chinese nationality born outside HK to a parent who is a permanent resident of the HKSAR listed in categories (1) or (2)

    what is form 881??


  8. #18

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Tsim Sha Tsui, Shatin
    Posts
    49

    Dear,
    just keep in your mind, to have right of abode (ROA) and to have chinese nationality are two different issues, you may not qualify for Chinese nationality but you can still qualify for ROA even if you were born outside Hong Kong and you dont hold Chinese passport. you will never lose your Right of abode, because it is your right, but you can lose your nationality. if i know your case more then i may be able to help you.


  9. #19

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    23,221
    Quote Originally Posted by shafinbutt
    you will never lose your Right of abode
    Simply not true. If you are born outside HK and are not of Chinese nationality then you acquire Right of Abode by being ordinarily resident here for 7 years. If you subesequently do not visit HK in any period of 36 months then you will automatically lose the Right of Abode, and it will be replaced with the Right to Land.

  10. #20

    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    5

    Hey people, I am an ABC, and I received my Permanent ID card with ROA as a non-Chinese permanent resident in February of 2006. At the time of birth, my parents were both permanent residents. My dad had a recent permanent ID card, and my mom tried to get her's but didn't go through with it because she didn't think the hassle of flying back for further documentation requests was worth it.

    How to do it:

    Apply at the HK immigration office. They will ask for every piece of documentation imaginable on both sides of the world going all the way back to your parent's birth certificates. They will most certainly need additional documents.

    Few things that helped me out:

    1. Parents still had all their identity documents from when they were little kids.

    2. After 1997, I went back to HK several times on the way to a teaching position in China and frequent business trips to China usually passing HK, and I was never away from HK for mre than 36 months. This matters because if you are, they will only give you RTL, and you have to repeat the 7 years.

    3. Persistence. Every time they said it would be difficult, I kept pushing and trying to get more documents. Even a relative I knew in the immigration department said I couldn't get it, but she was incorrect.

    4. My Immigration case worker decided that I could not be Chinese national PR because my parents already were US permanent residents at the time of my birth. If one of them was on student visa, I could have still been deemed a Chinese national.

    So now I have the non-Chinese Permanent ID card, and I use my US passport to go to mainland China. I have the same thing that you can get if you stay in Hong Kong for seven years only I got it fast-tracked by proving that my parents were HK residents, which made me one too upon my birth.

    I don't feel it's a good idea to get the Home Return Permit as you lose the U.S. government layer of protection in China. Plus, as a P.R., you are eligible to get the APEC Card, which is better because it gives you visa free access to all the APEC countries (including China.) You also don't have to wait in line at the immigration counters.

    Hope that helps.


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