Is Hong Kong really that undesirable when it comes to bringing up a child?

[closedcasket]

I have no problem if you have a different view. I have no problem if you hate or dislike Hong Kong and want to leave ASAP.

What I have a problem with is you making incorrect/misleading statements about Hong Kong, and that needs to be corrected.

Here is the recurring theme.....someone says something negative about Hong Kong = that means they must dislike and hate Hong Kong and want to leave ASAP.

How do you come to that conclusion?

There is always this overtone if you say something bad about Hong Kong you must hate it and therefore go back to where you came from (aka you know where the airport is ).

[usehername]

Classic example of twisting words. When did I ever suggest that "long term expats" aren't happy living here?

And when did I say you ever suggested long term expats aren't happy living here?

you said short term expats were 'more honest' about hk. Short term expats may well give a more realistic view of life as a newish arrival. But long term expats can give more of a realistic view of what it's like to settle down and make this 'home'.

The OP wants to know about raising a child - from newborn to school. That's a long term question which can best be answered by long term people.

[HowardCoombs]

I think short term expats like myself and Kimwy66 are able to give more blunt, honest and unbiased answers because this isn't "home" to us.

Thats one way to look at it. Another way is you're too new to know better while people that have been here for a while have learned and understood things a lot better.

People that consider Hong Kong home are understandably going to be reluctant to criticize it.

Reglars criticize Hong Kong all the time but perhpas during your short stay you havent yet seen that.

No one likes to think they are raising their kids in anything less than an ideal environment.

You're right and between myself and my wife we have decided Hong Kong is an ideal place for our kids. With so many kids around us, clearly we are not alone in this decision. Those that do disagree quickly choose to leave.

No one wants to admit that the very air they breath is toxic

According to EPD, the air is not toxic, are you suggesting they are lying?

But all that being said, I do feel it is important to be honest with potential expats who are thinking of moving here

Honesty from your perspective and in your eyes looks awfully like ignorance to me. Yes, I've been here longer and I believe I know more than you.

[closedcasket]

Thats one way to look at it. Another way is you're too new to know better while people that have been here for a while have learned and understood things a lot better. Reglars criticize Hong Kong all the time but perhpas during your short stay you havent yet seen that. You're right and between myself and my wife we have decided Hong Kong is an ideal place for our kids. With so many kids around us, clearly we are not alone in this decision. Those that do disagree quickly choose to leave.According to EPD, the air is not toxic, are you suggesting they are lying?
Honesty from your perspective and in your eyes looks awfully like ignorance to me. Yes, I've been here longer and I believe I know more than you.

I've lived here 6 years...do you consider that a short stay?

and yes, I consider the air toxic and harmful..(people routinely move out of Hong Kong due to the poor air quality)....the fact that you don't is very telling.

But what is even more telling is that you feel the need to compare yourself to me and claim "you know more than me". Is that why your on Geo? To prove to the Internet world that you know more than others?

[HowardCoombs]

I've lived here 6 years...do you consider that a short stay?

I cant say, I just know that you are spewing a ton of nonesense which tells me you havent learned much.

and yes, I consider the air toxic and harmful..(people routinely move out of Hong Kong due to the poor air quality)....the fact that you don't is very telling.

I trust what EPD publishes and know that while pollution levels are not ideal, they are not at toxic levels.
I firmly believe my family benefits (overall) by being here even with the air not being perfect. Other families feel differently and leave, so be it. As can be seen from tightness of school places, clearly my choices are not the ones of a minority.

But what is even more telling is that you feel the need to compare yourself to me and claim "you know more than me". Is that why your on Geo? To prove to the Internet world that you know more than others?

I'm here to counteract the misinformation you are spreading. To show that your assumptions are wrong, your conclusions misguided and your advice faulty.

[kimwy66]

I cant say, I just know that you are spewing a ton of nonesense which tells me you havent learned much.

I trust what EPD publishes and know that while pollution levels are not ideal, they are not at toxic levels.
I firmly believe my family benefits (overall) by being here even with the air not being perfect. Other families feel differently and leave, so be it. As can be seen from tightness of school places, clearly my choices are not the ones of a minority.
I'm here to counteract the misinformation you are spreading. To show that your assumptions are wrong, your conclusions misguided and your advice faulty.

Even the EPD has admitted that their self-developed air quality measurements are not acceptable. They fall well short of WHO safe limits, it has never been published how the safe limits conclusions were developed, the scheme has not been updated for nearly 25 years and they have failed since 1998 to even record some seriously damaging pollutants.

Fortunately, unlike some people here, they have realised they were wrong. From 2014 EPD will abandon their own system in favour of measurements and reporting to WHO standards. It is now a priority for EPD to bring this into effect. Only then will we know the true extent of the pollution in Hong Kong. Until then we can all check http://www.greenpeace.org/eastasia/c...llution-graph/ which is using WHO guidelines.

[HowardCoombs]

Even the EPD has admitted that their self-developed air quality measurements are not acceptable. They fall well short of WHO safe limits, it has never been published how the safe limits conclusions were developed, the scheme has not been updated for nearly 25 years and they have failed since 1998 to even record some seriously damaging pollutants.

I fail to see how this makes Hong Kong's air toxic.

Fortunately, unlike some people here, they have realised they were wrong. From 2014 EPD will abandon their own system in favour of measurements and reporting to WHO standards. It is now a priority for EPD to bring this into effect. Only then will we know the true extent of the pollution in Hong Kong. Until then we can all check http://www.greenpeace.org/eastasia/c...llution-graph/ which is using WHO guidelines.

Hurray. I love a government that admits mistakes and makes changes to improve itself. Is this now a good time to bring up gun control?

[closedcasket]

I fail to see how this makes Hong Kong's air toxic.
Hurray. I love a government that admits mistakes and makes changes to improve itself. Is this now a good time to bring up gun control?

For your sake, it would be wise to divert the topic over to guns in the US.....that's a much smarter move than trying to defend HK air toxicity. ...

I think bringing US guns into the thread is the equivalent of waving the white flag...

[closedcasket]

Even the EPD has admitted that their self-developed air quality measurements are not acceptable. They fall well short of WHO safe limits, it has never been published how the safe limits conclusions were developed, the scheme has not been updated for nearly 25 years and they have failed since 1998 to even record some seriously damaging pollutants.

Fortunately, unlike some people here, they have realised they were wrong. From 2014 EPD will abandon their own system in favour of measurements and reporting to WHO standards. It is now a priority for EPD to bring this into effect. Only then will we know the true extent of the pollution in Hong Kong. Until then we can all check http://www.greenpeace.org/eastasia/c...llution-graph/ which is using WHO guidelines.

It's pretty pointless with HC... You could say that it rains a lot in the summer here, and he would argue it doesn't

[Creative83]

I cant say, I just know that you are spewing a ton of nonesense which tells me you havent learned much.

I trust what EPD publishes and know that while pollution levels are not ideal, they are not at toxic levels.
I firmly believe my family benefits (overall) by being here even with the air not being perfect. Other families feel differently and leave, so be it. As can be seen from tightness of school places, clearly my choices are not the ones of a minority.
I'm here to counteract the misinformation you are spreading. To show that your assumptions are wrong, your conclusions misguided and your advice faulty.

Dude, you're way to patient.

Just let them offend everyone from everywhere.