View Poll Results: Are you against vaccinations?

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  • Yes

    1 3.03%
  • No, I believe in Science

    32 96.97%
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Are you against vaccinations?

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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullexile:
    Grunt has strong negative views on them as well.
    That's a major over-simplification.

    As a basic starting position, it seems to me that sticking a needle into someone's bloodstream and injecting a mixture of substances which do not naturally get there is an activity for which the onus absolutely has to be on proving that the benefits are substantial, and is not something that should be done "just in case". That being so, I have absolutely no problem at all with vaccinations for things for which all of the following are true:

    1) The consequences of catching the disease have a significant(*) possibility of being serious & permanent, or terminal

    2) The vaccine has a high (*) efficacy

    3) The vaccine has a low (*) risk of side-effects

    4) There is a significant (*) risk of catching the disease in the environment the person receiving the vaccination will be in

    (*) These terms are subjective and an arbitrary line has to be drawn somewhere. There is an obvious linkage between them in that for a disease which is endemic and fatal the acceptable risk of side-effects would be higher than for something that is very rare and not fatal or permanent disabling.

    Polio, diphtheria, tetanus, whooping cough, tuberculosis, HPV (for women at least), rubella (for women who are or who are planning to become pregnant and haven't previous caught it) and hepatitis, (and I've probably forgotten some others, particularly for specific populations or environments) clearly meet these criteria for any reasonable place you could draw the arbitrary line.

    For me, with my arbitrary lines would exclude chickenpox (on basis 1), flu (on basis 1 & 2, except perhaps within vulnerable sub-populations for whom the consequences may be more serious than a couple of weeks off work/school), cholera (on basis 2), and rubella (for children, on basis 1).

    Were it to be relevant to me I would do more research to decide on measles, mumps, yellow fever, and anything else that might be proposed.

    I am also very much in favour of encouraging kids to play in the dirt, that being part of the natural way of building up their immune systems which has stood the test of time reasonably well.

  2. #32

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    I liked Grunts post mostly for the last sentence. Kids playing in dirt is nature's way of building a good immune system. There is far too much sanitising and keeping kids away from anything remotely dirty in my opinion.

    My only disagreement would be on Rubella. Sure, it is a mild illness. I remember having it as a kid. The issue is a pregnant woman who is not immune, and it does happen that people are unaware of their own immunity. At least of girls were immunised this would prevent any mishaps.

    Agree on chickenpox, don't really see the need for a mass immunisation. The incidence of major problems is very, very low, and more often occur in immuno-compromised patients. For whom vaccination is offered, although short lasting and needing repeat applications on every exposure.

    HK_Katherine likes this.

  3. #33

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    Here are the deaths from measles in the UK figures. On the same site are immunisation figures.

    http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAweb&HPA.../1195733835814


  4. #34

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    Here are the potential side effects. On balance I think the side effects are worth the number of lives saved.


  5. #35

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    Original Post Deleted
    I did not vote for the same reason.

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by kimwy66:
    I liked Grunts post mostly for the last sentence. Kids playing in dirt is nature's way of building a good immune system. There is far too much sanitising and keeping kids away from anything remotely dirty in my opinion.

    My only disagreement would be on Rubella. Sure, it is a mild illness. I remember having it as a kid. The issue is a pregnant woman who is not immune, and it does happen that people are unaware of their own immunity. At least of girls were immunised this would prevent any mishaps.

    Agree on chickenpox, don't really see the need for a mass immunisation. The incidence of major problems is very, very low, and more often occur in immuno-compromised patients. For whom vaccination is offered, although short lasting and needing repeat applications on every exposure.
    On chickenpox, in the early 1990s over 10000 people were hospitalised each year in the US of whom 100 to 150 died. Most of these were previously healthy - not sure I would call that minor. I know it is a small number compared to other causes of death but if it is easily preventable then it does seem a waste of lives.

    http://www.cdc.gov/chickenpox/surveillance.html
    Last edited by hullexile; 11-04-2014 at 05:40 AM.

  7. #37

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    This article I came across this morning belongs here :
    http://www.iflscience.com/health-and...are-being-lied


  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by HowardCoombs:
    This article I came across this morning belongs here :
    http://www.iflscience.com/health-and...are-being-lied
    You're a day late HC

    http://hongkong.geoexpat.com/forum/8...ml#post2794574
    wtbhotia likes this.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by hullexile:
    On chickenpox, in the early 1990s over 10000 people were hospitalised each year in the US of whom 100 to 150 died. Most of these were previously healthy - not sure I would call that minor. I know it is a small number compared to other causes of death but if it is easily preventable then it does seem a waste of lives.

    http://www.cdc.gov/chickenpox/surveillance.html
    Is not the chickenpox problem at least as much because of the fact it causes shingles in adults which can be a much worse disease?

    I had chickenpox as a child - it was horrid but not life threatening - but a relative had it as an adult and that was really nasty.

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by kimwy66:
    You're a day late HC
    Apologies - I watched the video and assumed (mistakenly) that the link was related to the video...Promise, will pay more attention next time