Can Obama beat McCain?

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  1. #71

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    >> I am surprized you havent uncovered Prescott Bush's pre war
    >> financing of the Nazi's

    I thought that was covered earlier in the thread.


  2. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Claire ex-ax:
    Since 1945, the strength of the US dollars has rested on it being the international reserve currency for oil transactions. The US prints billions of these “petrodollars” which are used by other countries to purchase oil and energy from OPEC producers. These fiat petrodollars then go from the OPEC producers back to the US via treasury bills or other dollar assets, in fact these dollars can only be used to purchase US dollar assets.

    Yes, the US is strong enough to dominate the world militarily. But economically it is in decline, less and less competitive, and increasingly in debt. And, by its actions, it is showing it.
    Interesting theory. I argue that in the immediate aftermath of WWII,the US dollar was the reserve currency because the US was the only country in the Anglo-Saxon economic system still standing. If not the US dollar, then what currency from 1945 until today?
    Being the reserve currency does give the US an economic edge, though.
    And your examples of the US being in economic decline are? And the examples of it being less competitive? And competitive compared with what?

  3. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by worldsgreatest:
    any responses to sky hook? it surprises me how many people believe the lies that have been spun by the administration and that people can defend bush and his messed up foreign policies. There is a reason the rest of the world hates America (The administration - not the people), and its not because they are jealous!
    I imagine the Bush family is not the only ones getting rich off of oil and guns. Nor were they the first. And they won't be the last.
    However, I doubt that US foreign policy is being set by a quest for yet more money.
    I can see, in Iraq, a personal grudge or perhaps a need to one-up dad, in the calculation; allowing GW to hear what he wanted to hear in the intelligence reports.
    But, without 9/11, none of this would have happened.

  4. #74

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    "any responses to sky hook?"

    You're kidding right? You're going to blame the current administration for all of America's woes? What, the whole world hates America because of Bush?

    Does anyone recall how he even made it to power? He was voted in. His family history has been common knowledge for a long time but only now it's a problem?

    So I'd really like to know the pro Obama participants in this thread thoughts on the big O's preacher? You're going to tell me that despite the fact that he sat and listened to him for 20 years it all went in one ear and out the other? Who are we kidding?

    My firm belief is Obama, like me, can't believe he's where he is today. He got swept up by a juggernaut far bigger than him. Americans don't love him, they love the idea of him.

    If he had had a long term goal of ever running for president he would have disassociated himself from any sort of scandal. The reality is Hollywood and as we've said before, Oprah, appointed him the messiah and he thought, what the hell this is fun.


  5. #75

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    its always convenient to ignore the truth isnt it? the whole world hates america becuse it sees itself as the self appointed leader of the world, and u want to continue with the policies which got u in this mess in the first place. American foreign policy has worked so well and brought peace to the world-not!


  6. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by aussiegal:
    "any responses to sky hook?"

    You're kidding right? You're going to blame the current administration for all of America's woes? What, the whole world hates America because of Bush?

    Does anyone recall how he even made it to power? He was voted in. His family history has been common knowledge for a long time but only now it's a problem?

    So I'd really like to know the pro Obama participants in this thread thoughts on the big O's preacher? You're going to tell me that despite the fact that he sat and listened to him for 20 years it all went in one ear and out the other? Who are we kidding?

    My firm belief is Obama, like me, can't believe he's where he is today. He got swept up by a juggernaut far bigger than him. Americans don't love him, they love the idea of him.

    If he had had a long term goal of ever running for president he would have disassociated himself from any sort of scandal. The reality is Hollywood and as we've said before, Oprah, appointed him the messiah and he thought, what the hell this is fun.
    Actually you are not quite right about Bush being elected. If I recall, there was the small matter of "hanging chads" (votes for Gore) and votes not counted in upper Florida and the US Supreme Court putting a neo con like themselves into office. The Supreme Court makeup would have been altered by Gore and if he got two terms it'd not a be a good place for the neo-con Justices. They too had self interest.

    Florida's 25 electoral college votes ended up giving Bush his victory despite losing the popular vote in that state.

    All Al Gore needed to win the Presidency was either New Hampshire or Florida.

    The world is a lot less safe today than when Bush took office and yes, his cowboy administration has done more to de-stabilize the Middle East than anything Saddam would have done if he remained in power.

    I think a large part of the world has a dislike and mistrust of their President and rightly so.

    What I find unbelievable is how the American people have allowed this Bible thumping moron to stay in office twice!!! But we all know that Americans will not charge President's during a war.

    As far as candidates disassociating themselves from scandal, it is very hard if not nearly impossible.
    Last edited by Football16; 22-05-2008 at 03:54 PM.

  7. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by worldsgreatest:
    " the whole world hates america becuse it sees itself as the self appointed leader of the world,
    I just can't believe that one man can shoulder the blame for this. I'm pretty sure the US has felt this way for a long time and not just since he got into power.

    And as for 'the whole world hating America' i think it might be fashionable to say that now but far from the truth. Someone has to lead, you want to leave it to the Russians? The Saudis? The Iranians? The Aussies? The Kiwis? Who?

  8. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by aussiegal:
    I just can't believe that one man can shoulder the blame for this.
    Agreed, Bush just isn't intelligent enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by aussiegal:
    Someone has to lead, you want to leave it to the Russians? The Saudis? The Iranians? The Aussies? The Kiwis? Who?
    Why does someone have to lead? History - and every James Bond movie - tells us that world domination doesn't work. Every nation that has tried it has ultimately failed.

  9. #79

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    But if no one has to lead no one will get involved. Imagine the atrocities that would be committed if there was no one that kind of kept countries honest.


  10. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by aussiegal:
    So I'd really like to know the pro Obama participants in this thread thoughts on the big O's preacher? You're going to tell me that despite the fact that he sat and listened to him for 20 years it all went in one ear and out the other? Who are we kidding?

    My firm belief is Obama, like me, can't believe he's where he is today. He got swept up by a juggernaut far bigger than him. Americans don't love him, they love the idea of him.

    If he had had a long term goal of ever running for president he would have disassociated himself from any sort of scandal. The reality is Hollywood and as we've said before, Oprah, appointed him the messiah and he thought, what the hell this is fun.
    lol

    so harvard law, being elected to law review 2 harvard, years of community service after harvard and being elected into the senate isn't enough evidence for long term presidential goals?

    most americans aren't so fixated on someone having "long term goals" of becoming president....these candidates are often more willing to bend and shift just to get elected (maybe this is important elsewhere...but not in the US)

    in fact americans are receptive to people coming in from the private and public sectors into politics - McCain was tortured in Vietnam, Eisenhower as a war hero was also warmly welcomed into politics, again I must name Abe Lincoln again, Herbert Hoover was a MINING ENGINEER for heaven sakes...americans are more concerned with other factors

    As far as him not being able to believe where he is - probably every presidential candidate has that sensation including Hillary.

    I'm not really that religious so I could care less about the preacher. Personally I think most of the candidates just appear to be close to God to improve their chances of being elected. I might feel differently if Obama didn't have so many other influences and he seemed religious but looking at his family and background I have a hard time believing that he followed the preachers teachings or that he is even religious at all. Though it makes for good TV.

    His success has little to do with hollywood or Oprah....I've spent time in iowa and trust me many of his supporters aren't the type to follow hollywood.
    Last edited by meiguoren; 22-05-2008 at 05:24 PM.

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