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ROA Appeal Questions

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  1. #1

    Lightbulb ROA Appeal Questions

    I'm currently applying to jobs in the HK, but I live overseas, and one of the requirements for some of the jobs states "permanent hkid" required. Previously, I had thought that I had permanent HKID, but on further inspection (and after I submitted my initial job applications) I realized that I only have a regular HKID, with Right to Land (RTL) status. I have also confirmed with the company, and they said RTL doesn't cut it.

    Because I was born overseas before 1997, to HK citizens, and returned to HK after 18 months of HKSAR establishment, I originally had the ability to obtain ROA after my return. However, after my first visit in 2009, I did not return until 2014 (when I then applied for verification of eligibility). My parents, didn't know that they would be looking at your retrospective returns, prior to your application for an ID. Thus, I now have RTL.

    Because the jobs I am interested in applying/want to stay in HK for, require a HKPID, I would like to obtain this status WITHOUT staying for 7 years.

    After doing a lot of research, and reading all of the related gov websites. I had some questions I was hoping some of you may have experience with/ can answer.

    1)a)Can I reapply for the verification of eligibility again? Because I already have RTL. If I apply again, the results will probably still be the same, but I am hoping to appeal.
    1)b) What are some people's experiences with appealing their decision?


    "Evidence" I hope will work for the appeal, OR I will submit to my second Verification of Permanent Identity Card include:
    -documents of my report card, during 2009-2014, stating that I was in school (and even summer school), so was unable to return due to academic reasons.
    2)a) Do you think this would be a valid reason?

    OR do you think that I could argue, that because my parents didn't know (and at the time I was under 18), they should not have counted the initial 2009 visit, as I hadn't "technically" decided to settle in HK until 2014, when I applied for the HKPID.

    Thank you for your input.


  2. #2

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    I can’t advise regarding a VEPIC appeal but will say RTL gives you the same right to live and work in HK that ROA gives, so I think it is probably a misunderstanding on what RTL is by the hiring company. Seems many are ignorant about it.


  3. #3

    I had initially thought so as well, and understand that there are barely any difference between RTL and ROA. I even let them know that this let's me work and live in HK freely. But, on their website, and in their email reply, they stated that it this would not satisfy their requirement. And they only wish to offer the positions to HKPID holders.


  4. #4

    Join Date
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    564

    Are these government jobs you're applying for? If not, I suspect the requirement for HKPIC is the employer only wants to hire people who know hk well,.e.g.ruling out new immigrants such as one way permit holders.

    I don't think your argument for oversees studies would work.  Because if hk was your permanent home, you would have returned regularly during holidays.


  5. #5

    Mhmm, that's what I'm wondering.
    I may call them to see, but I wonder if they'll give me a straightforward answer, or just tell me to go and submit all the documents.
    The one thing I wonder is if we apply what the 7 year rule states, they also include studying as a temporary absence, and wondering if that would apply in my situation. As I was considered, absent for school.

    "This means that if you go somewhere else for a holiday, for business or to study, your ordinary residence is not interrupted."


  6. #6

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    6,745

    You sure you don't qualify for Chinese nationality and thus HK ROA?

    I was born overseas prior 1997, did not come here before 2009, got everything


  7. #7

    Yea, they were "settled" before I came along.


  8. #8

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    1,675
    Quote Originally Posted by iliveforsleep:
    I'm currently applying to jobs in the HK, but I live overseas, and one of the requirements for some of the jobs states "permanent hkid" required. Previously, I had thought that I had permanent HKID, but on further inspection (and after I submitted my initial job applications) I realized that I only have a regular HKID, with Right to Land (RTL) status. I have also confirmed with the company, and they said RTL doesn't cut it.

    Because I was born overseas before 1997, to HK citizens, and returned to HK after 18 months of HKSAR establishment, I originally had the ability to obtain ROA after my return. However, after my first visit in 2009, I did not return until 2014 (when I then applied for verification of eligibility). My parents, didn't know that they would be looking at your retrospective returns, prior to your application for an ID. Thus, I now have RTL.

    Because the jobs I am interested in applying/want to stay in HK for, require a HKPID, I would like to obtain this status WITHOUT staying for 7 years.

    After doing a lot of research, and reading all of the related gov websites. I had some questions I was hoping some of you may have experience with/ can answer.

    1)a)Can I reapply for the verification of eligibility again? Because I already have RTL. If I apply again, the results will probably still be the same, but I am hoping to appeal.
    1)b) What are some people's experiences with appealing their decision?


    "Evidence" I hope will work for the appeal, OR I will submit to my second Verification of Permanent Identity Card include:
    -documents of my report card, during 2009-2014, stating that I was in school (and even summer school), so was unable to return due to academic reasons.
    2)a) Do you think this would be a valid reason?

    OR do you think that I could argue, that because my parents didn't know (and at the time I was under 18), they should not have counted the initial 2009 visit, as I hadn't "technically" decided to settle in HK until 2014, when I applied for the HKPID.

    Thank you for your input.
    I'm in a very similar situation with RTL: non-Chinese ROA to RTL downgrade in 1999; Submitted an Appeal to the ROPT in late 2015; Immigration Department released their response to the Appeal in early 2018; now proceeding to Tribunal.

    The Department indicated in 2016 they would - cough cough - overlook 7 years; and can we give you a non-Chinese ROA right now, but I've left it at RTL and decided to proceed to Tribunal, as I would also quite like an HKSAR Passport and HRP.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by dossier:
    The Department indicated in 2016 they would - cough cough - overlook 7 years; and can we give you a non-Chinese ROA right now
    Hello Dossier,

    So they didn't reply to your appeal until 4 years later? Would you mind telling me the details of your appeal? And what reason(s)/evidence you're considering giving?

    Would you be able to explain more about what you mean in 2016 they overlooked the 7 year stay?

    I am currently considering reapplying in person for the permanent HKID eligibility, and then appealing their decision if I don't get ROA with the evidence I had mentioned earlier.

  10. #10

    Join Date
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    Original Post Deleted
    It's been in this thread since November 2014 - https://geoexpat.com/forum/54/thread310005.html

    The Immd strongly hinted (wink wink style) in 2016 that, based on holding RTL since 2009 (despite the fact I hadn't been around much), they could do non-Chinese ROA HKPIC then. I decided to hold out, as RTL is "good enough for now", and I would prefer the ROPT to look at the topic. I also didn't want the issuance of a non-Chinese ROA HKPIC to "cancel" the Tribunal process. Immd's position is that I'm not a Chinese Citizen, so no HKSAR PP etc.

    I'm just generally of the view that RTL will either fade into obscurity or be eliminated by 2047. It's a bit like British National (Overseas) or British Subject or British Overseas Citizen etc in the UK - no one has a clue generally what this is (nor particularly cares). Worst still, these minority categories tend to get negatively revised later (colloquially known as "screwed over"). It's a bit like "Indefinite Leave to Remain" in the UK - which is neither "Indefinite" nor "Permanent" (because of the 2 year loss rule). Most of us can't really keep track of changes.

    So my view is that HK will go the way of just simply non-Chinese foreigner and Chinese Citizen ROA before or after 2047. It would be consistent with Beijing's view of foreigners vs Chinese Citizens.
    Last edited by dossier; 28-05-2018 at 10:48 AM.
    Morrison likes this.

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